Q: Can you explain a little bit about yourself?

A-Josephine: We are both in the first year at Cairo University, we went both to the Innovation Academy, a learning center where we did the Sudanese curriculum in English. Cairo University was our first option. Our second option was Alexandria University. We had four options for different universities. 

 Q: Can I ask you how much were you paying for school fees at the Innovation Academy?

 A-Grace: It was not really expensive, we paid 6.000 EgP per year. 

 Q: And did the school help you to register for the exams at the Embassy and to apply to university?

 A-Grace: Not at all, we were supposed to do that alone, get informed on our own. 

 Q: Did you take Arabic as a subject of examination?

 A-Josephine: No. 

 Q: Are the subjects of your exam for entering university different depending on what undergraduate you want to study?

 A-Josephine: Yes, we chose the science section at senior 3, this is because we took science subjects at the Sudanese exam for entering University. I did it twice

 A-Grace:: I did it just once. 

 Q: Did you take the exam in English?

 A-Josephine: Yes, we did. 

 Q: And do you know something about the translation of the exams? Is it better to take it in Arabic or in English?

 A-Josephine: Well, translations in English are really bad. We practiced in class for the exams. We even needed to ask teachers the meaning of individual exercises as sometimes we could not understand it. But you know, that depends on the year, for example, the year before us the English Sudanese exam for entering university was really difficult and almost everyone failed it, but this year it was better Angelina explains. But you know it is also difficult and there is money in the middle. Every time you want to do the exam you need to pay 550 dollars, that is a lot. So what happens is that sometimes they work to collect the money and pay for the exam, some of them study and work at the same time, others stop studying and work for later study again, anyways, it is difficult to really focus and pass the exam, many also feel demotivated. 

 Q: Do you know if the system of the Sudanese exams to university is corrupted?

 A-Grace and Josephine:: No! They don’t discriminate against you. They do not even consider the names. You have your student number. 

 Q: Was it easy to get into the Egyptian university?

 A-Josephine: No, some of the foreign students even do not try because of the huge money that application implies. Most of the students that graduated with me are now working.

 Q: Which barriers are the main ones?

 A-Josephine: The biggest barrier is money. For example, once you have done the exam, just for applying to the university it is 2.000 EgP, and maybe you do not even get into the university. If they do not accept you, you lose your money. Well, due to the COVID-19 and the year that we missed, now the application fee is 1.500 EgP, which is the money that you are paying before entering university. And then if you enter, you need to pay again 2.000 EgP to complete the process, and then every university year you pay more money. It depends on the college where you are studying, for example in mine I pay 650 USD, that is around 12,000 EgP

 Q: Do you know if this also happens to Egyptians?

 A-Grace: No, only to foreigners. They changed that last year. Earlier Egyptians and foreigners were treated the same, but this year they changed it. 

 Q: So you have friends who entered without paying money and it was pretty easy for them, and do you know why they changed that?

 A-Josephine: Yes, my sister (Josephine’s sister) entered normal, we don’t know why. 

 Q: Have you thought about doing university in Sudan?

 A-Grace: We cannot return there until we have our case fixed, and also universities in Egypt are better than in Sudan. 

 Q: Do you face racism from the teachers or students at public universities?

 A-Josephine: No, we do not face racism at all. There are even systems where you can complain. The worst thing is the language. In theory, the classes are in English, and the exams are too, but the teachers always explain in Egyptian Arabic, and if someone tells him to switch the other students from Egypt complain as many of them do not understand English. I mean, we are from South Sudan, and we speak Arabic but our dialect, but we do not understand the Egyptian dialect very well and we cannot write or read it at all.

 Q: So what are you doing then?

 A-Grace: The thing is that we need to do a lot of work at home, go through the books, search on the internet and make our own notes. 

 Q: But you need to go to class anyway even if you do not understand anything? Is attendance compulsory?

 A-Angelina: Yes, that’s it. Attendance is compulsory so you really need to go there, it is a waste of time. Then at home, we need to work much more. 

 Q: And what happens with other students who do not know English at all?

 A-Grace: Well that happened today in a laboratory class. There was a guy who did not understand Arabic, so he asked the doctor if he could explain in English.

 Q: And how did the teacher react to that?

 A-Grace: Well, it is difficult also for the teachers as even if they start explaining in English, the Egyptian students complain and say that they do not understand, so the teacher does not know how to balance that.

 A-Angelina: That is the main challenge 

 Q: What are you planning to do after you finish your studies? 

 A: After finishing, probably going back, (yes, yes, yes),

 Q: Why?

 A-Angeline: Here they do not accept foreigners to work. If you want to work for the government, at a school, as a nurse, or as a doctor, they will not accept you. So after we finish, we go back. 

 Q: You told me that you did not really know how to write and read Arabic, are you motivated to learn it?

 A-Josephine: I was interested before, but not anymore. The university encourages foreigners to learn Arabic. When you are new the foreign affairs department gives you kind of a partner who knows Arabic and is supposed to guide and teach you, but no one does that. And I mean Arabic is difficult, if it were just like English, it would be easier, but it is hard. But at least the teachers when they write something on the blackboard they do it in English. 

 Q: And what about AUC? 

 A-Grace: It is too expensive, and they do not offer scholarships.